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New windows for our house; advise please

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This topic contains 12 replies, has 3 voices, and was last updated by  Anonymous 6th November 2006 at 9:56 pm.

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  • #3605

    naxosbe
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        • BIC Junior Member
        • ★★★
        Member since: 18th May 2006

        When we builded our house in 2000, very simple, ordinary wooden frames and very thin glass was installed. Now we would like to change for Aluminium or Plastic frames and double glass. Who has experience with that ? We live very close to the sea ( 100 meters ) so it needs to be the best solution.
        Most  people advise plastic, however I am afraid the sun will bleech the color after years ?

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        #4034

        Anonymous
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            • BIC 2.0 Newbie
            Member since: 1st January 1970

            I don’t have direct experience but we were advised that it is best to avoid aluminium if you are close to the sea.  Although the aluminium is coated if there is the slightest break in the coating, exposure to salt spray will cause it to grow a fur coat.  Wood is generally thought to be best in this situation but, of course, it does require regular maintenance.

            Warwick

            #4382

            LGiddings
                • Topics: 6
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                • BIC Old Hand
                • ★★★★
                Member since: 13th November 2005

                Having worked for a building company based in Ag Nic for around two and half years I would recomend either MEKAL or ALFALUMIN who both have offices in town.All windows,doors and shutters are well manufactured and installed to a very high standard.All products are made from extruded alluminium and powder coated to what colour you choose from their fairly comprehensive range.
                Good luck which ever type you choose!
                cheers D.Giddings

                #4669

                Anonymous
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                    • BIC 2.0 Newbie
                    Member since: 1st January 1970

                    LGiddings wrote: Having worked for a building company based in Ag Nic for around  two and half years I would recomend either MEKAL or ALFALUMIN who both have offices in town.All windows,doors and shutters are well manufactured and installed to a very high standard.All products are made from extruded alluminium and powder coated to what colour you choose from their fairly comprehensive range.
                       Good luck which ever type you choose!
                       cheers D.Giddings

                    We have this type of windows, doors & shutters. For quite a while I thought that they were plastic, if they are coated the coating is very thick, i would say that they are more like plastic dipped rather than coated. I only discovered that they were metal when one was hit with a metal chair (don’t ask how) and dented but the coating is intact. I would recommend them to anyone.

                    #4910

                    naxosbe
                        • Topics: 6
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                        • BIC Junior Member
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                        Member since: 18th May 2006

                        Nurse Gladys wrote: I would recommend them to anyone.

                        Nurse Gladys, you mean recommend to everyone or to nobody ?

                        To all, thanks for the advice, still in doubt to use plastic or aluminium…

                        To D.Giddings, do you think these companies would also like to do a house on Naxos Island ?

                        #5113

                        KindaII
                            • Topics: 1
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                            • BIC Junior Member
                            • ★★★
                            Member since: 12th October 2006

                            Aluminium is attacked by the salt from the sea and you are more likely to have a greater life from the plastic. Some plastic windows have a metal frame to them which is integral to the plastic window and well protected, that gives the window its strength and you would be unfortunate for the salt to reach the integral frame (the cheaper plastic windows do not have an aluminium frame and used to be not as robust).

                            Believe me aluminium windows will be attacked by the salt.

                            All plastic windows discolour but usually its over a period of time and as long as they are maintained and washed on a regular basis they should last for years.

                            #5291

                            naxosbe
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                                • BIC Junior Member
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                                Member since: 18th May 2006

                                Thanks to all, we will go for plastic.
                                Paulo.

                                #5439

                                Anonymous
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                                    • BIC 2.0 Newbie
                                    Member since: 1st January 1970

                                    naxosbe wrote:

                                    I would recommend them to anyone.

                                    Nurse Gladys, you mean recommend to everyone or to nobody ?

                                    I mean that I would recommend them to anyone who asked!

                                    By the way, several years ago I was told that plastic window frames were illegal in Sweden and a few other countries as they were considered a fire risk because they melt and fuse together in the heat making escape impossible.

                                    I have no idea if this is or was correct but it sounded reasonable to me and was one of the reasons that we never had plastic windows in the UK.

                                    #5568

                                    Anonymous
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                                        • BIC 2.0 Newbie
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                                        One of the problems with Aluminium frames or plastic ones with an embedded metal frame is the fitting. Often the fitter will drill holes through it to fix it to the opening. Since the holes are drilled after the protective coating has been applied it breaches that coating and leaves a path for salt ingress. Also they are usually made from extruded channel, which is coated before it is cut to shape. Again the corner joints provide a route for salt ingress unless they are really well sealed. You are somewhat at the mercy of the quality of workmanship rather than the quality of the materials.

                                        Don’t misunderstand me, I am not against Aluminium windows; we have them ourselves but we are about 10 km inland and there are hills between us and the sea. They are new so I cannot comment on their longevity.

                                        I was told by a colleague in Athens that Europa and Alumil were reckoned to be the two best makes in Greece. As far as I know the individual companies are then franchises using the main manufacturers system.

                                        Warwick

                                        #5687

                                        Anonymous
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                                            • BIC 2.0 Newbie
                                            Member since: 1st January 1970

                                            KindaII wrote:
                                            All plastic windows discolour but usually its over a period of time and as long as they are maintained and washed on a regular basis they should last for years.

                                            One of the major problems with plastic windows is the thickness, or lack of it in the extruded frames. Handles, latches and special hinges used for top opening windows are usually fixed with self tapping screws which eventually pull out. Back in the UK I used to run a company which supplied, among other things, rivets and fixing to the double glazing industry. We used to sell literally 100’s of thousands of "repair rivets". These were specially designed, plastic coated rivets which are used, by repairers, to solve this problem. They were not fitted as "original equipment" because self tapping screws enable adjustments to be made on site. Rivets do not.

                                            All systems, aluminium, plastic & wood have both advantages and dissadvantages, you pays your money and takes your choice!

                                            In my opinion the material chosen is not as important as the quality of the manufacture and the standard of the fitters. Unfortunately, in the UK, the fitters are usually self employed so you cannot judge them by the standards of previous work carried out by the manufacturer/supplier. I do not know if fitters are self employed in Crete or Naxos.

                                            John

                                            #5791

                                            KindaII
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                                                • BIC Junior Member
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                                                Member since: 12th October 2006

                                                Warwick

                                                The mitre joints in plastic windows can be welted so there isn’t a gap to allow water to penetrate. If the window is not built in when the walls are being built then they are drilled and plugged through the frame with the head of the plug being exposed to the inner frame of the opening light but this is of course enclosed if the window is shut. The gap between a post installed window into an existing whole in the wall is sealed with mastic to fill the gap. So all round you are pretty well protected but that doesn’t mean over time the salt will get to the metal stays of the windows.

                                                I also think RIC’s comments are also very valid….oh sorry and Kilkis of course.

                                                KindaII

                                                #5885

                                                Anonymous
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                                                    • BIC 2.0 Newbie
                                                    Member since: 1st January 1970

                                                    Mostly in Greece they are post installed, at least on conventional build. I have no experience of stone build.

                                                    We have no experience of our own windows yet but from what I have heard from other people there does tend to be a certain amount of moisture penetration in storm conditions. In that situation, moisture, and of course the salt it carries near the coast, could get to the screw fixings. That was my concern.

                                                    Warwick

                                                    #5966

                                                    Anonymous
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                                                        • BIC 2.0 Newbie
                                                        Member since: 1st January 1970

                                                        Sorry, should have said this before.

                                                        We also sold frame fixings in various sizes which were like a long, coarse threaded screw supplied with its own "Rawlplug" type plug. The screws were steel, zinc plated and most were also yellow passivated. We also sold one which had the screw head and shoulder (ie down to the start of the thread) plastic coated. I no longer have any actual figures but seem to remember that the zinc & yellow passivated outsold the others by about 80 to 1. Probably because the plastic coated ones were almost 50% more expensive!

                                                        The solutions to most double glazing problems are available, but at a price which the fitters (self employed and buying their own materials) are not often prepared to pay.

                                                        As I have previously pointed out a dissadvantage with plastic windows it is only fair that I do the same with aluminium frames! Their dissadvantage is their thermal conductivity. Being metal they will conduct heat to the outside of the frame. When they were just anodised aluminium they usually incorporated a "thermal break" in the extrusion (ie the extrusion was in two parts seperated by a non heat conductive plastic). When the aluminium is plastic coated this practise is usually abandoned.

                                                        I also regret to say that in the UK (all my comments refer only to the UK market) the price a customer pays often has little bearing on the quality of product supplied!

                                                        Sorry for the rambling, but I spent a considerable amount of my working life in double glazing factories!

                                                        John

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